One of The Odyssey's enduring strengths is the depth and complexity of the characters. One could read the text repeatedly and come away with fresh insights each time based on the multi-faceted nature of even the minor characters. We discussed the characters Telemachus and Penelope in Friday's class, and noted how our understanding of each character becomes more complex and varied as the story progresses. Depending on an individual's perspective, one can read Telemachus and Penelope as having positive and negative character traits. As we discovered Friday, textual supports exist for both positions.
Thus far in your reading, what do we know of Odysseus's character? What kind of man/king/husband/warrior/father/hero/guest/leader is he? If you had to sum him up in a sentence, how would you describe him? What character(s) in the book see him the same way? What specific passage(s) lead you to this description of Odysseus? Alternately, is such a summary even possible, or are the descriptions of Odysseus too complex for one sentence? (Remember to back up your position with textual evidence, and let us know which page and line numbers you are referencing.)
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Odysseus's character is definitely complicated and his actions can be interpreted in different ways. I am not sure that I could think of a way to accurately reflect his character in one sentence.
ReplyDeleteOdysseus is a good man who knows how to get what he wants, but the gods control his success. He is a beloved king who is loved by all of the people. Although he is not the most faithful of husbands, he claims to have never loved another woman except his wife. He is a great warrior, well-respected and semi-successful at Troy. From the text, I could gather nothing of his role as a father because he was not there for most of Telemachus's life. He is a respectable guest, and gladly accepts gifts and feasts from his hosts. As a leader, from what I could tell of his stories, he is a gracious leader and does his very best not to lead his crew astray.
One part of his character is completely proud, arrogant, and showy. For example, in book 8 when the Phaeacian's are having contests and a great feast to send off Odysseus on his journey, Broadsea mocks Odysseus after he refuses Laodamas's offer to compete in their sports. After Broadsea claims he is not an athlete, Odysseus takes great offense and brags that he could outperform them at any sport except sprinting, as he is worn down from his journeys on the sea. He throws a discus farther than the rest and then tells of defeating all but the archer god with his bow and arrow skills at Troy(p 196-198).
On the other hand, he is very emotional and grievous, even begs for others' mercy at times. Many times in the palace of King Alcinous does he cry because of the sad music played by the herald (p.194,208). Even as he enters the palace of King Alcinous in book 7, he clutches Queen Arete at the knees and begs her to grant him mercy (p.184). He does the same to nymph Circe in book 10 when he and his comrades have decided to leave after their 1 year stay (p.245).
Adding to his complex character, he is also a very manipulative and clever man. In his stories of his treacherous journey, he often got out of the sticky situations by tricking people. In book 9 in the cave of the one-eyed giant, he and his men escape after getting him drunk and stabbing him in the eye after he passes out . They ride out of the cave on the bellies of goats. Odysseus tells him his name is 'Nobody' so when the other giants come to investigate, he tells them nobody is there(p.222-225). Another prime example of his manipulative exploits is in book 10 where he uses a potent drug given to him by Hermes to counteract her spells that turned his comrades into pigs. She is then amazed that he is not enchanted by her and keeps he and his crew for a whole year (p.239).
Odysseus is a very complex but simple man. Thus far in the story he is discribed as a god-like man by his build and his ability to speak. But all his success has been with the help of the gods especially athena. Through out his journeys he has had to be a guest in forgein lands and use the help each king has generously given him. With out the help of the gods or other kings Odysseus would not even be alive.
ReplyDeleteThe character I believe he is most like is his son. Telemacus through the story has proven he is direct with what he wants and will do almost anything to get it. Telemacus refused to give up hope looking for his father and at the same time Odysseus refused to give up on his family and his fight to get home quickly.
To describe Odysseus in one sentence is impossible. He is the same guy deep down but with all his struggles he endures he changes through out the story, making it impossible to describe him in one word.
I agree with hcannon in saying that it would be difficult to come up with one sentence to effectively describe Odysseus. A few words do come to mind though: quick-thinking, confident, and a strong leader.
ReplyDeleteOne of the best examples of his quick-thinking is in book 9 on the island of the cyclops. His idea to sharpen a stake and blind him may not seem like a brilliant plan at first, but once the reader sees how the whole plan plays out his quick thinking really shows. First of all, he realizes that he can't kill the Cyclops because then they will be trapped in the cave. Secondly, he comes up with the idea to call himself "Nobody" so when the Cyclops calls for help his friends think it's "a plague sent here by mighty Zeus (pg. 224)." Lastly, by blinding the cyclops, him and his crew are able to escape under the bellies of the goats the next morning because the Cyclops won't be able to see them.
The second quality that really applies to him is his confidence. I think an example of his great confidence is in book 8 during the contest with the Phaecians. One of the people says that he is "no athlete" and didn't take him for "someone skilled in games, the kind that real men play (pg. 196)." This enrages Odysseus and he steps up to prove himself right away. After he blew away the competition in the discus he says, "Now go match that, you young pups, and straightaway I'll hurl you another just as far, I swear, or even farther! (pg. 198)." Considering he is a guest there and hardly knows these people, this statement he makes goes to show how much confidence he has in himself.
The last attribute that I think really applies to him is his ability to be a strong leader. An example of this is in book 10 when they are faced by the bewitching queen, Circe. He sends Eurylochus and twenty or so men to her palace and all of them besides Eurylochus are turned into swine by her. He comes back very scared and begs Odysseus not to go and tells him he "will never return yourself, I swear, you'll never bring back a single man alive ( pg. 238)." Odysseus though doesn't hesitate for a moment after Eurylochus says this. He shoots back and tells him "I must be off. Necessity drives me on (pg. 239)." If it weren't for him, it's likely that nobody would have gone back to her palace to try and save their men. Odysseus though was able to go back, save all his men, and receive instruction of what he was to do next.
I don't think these three adjectives, confidence, strong leadership, and quick-thinking, come close to doing him justice as a person, because he is a very complex man, and it would take more than a post on this blog to do him justice.
I would say that Odysseus is consistently inconsistent. I don't think of myself as a cynical person, but I tend to see these characters in a more negative light. Most of these characters come off as fake to me. They all make great emotional speeches so they can get what they want. Odysseus is the king of tact. He is clever, so much so that I would associate the words cunning, trickster, and hustler as some of the words that would decribe him. He isn't without his good qualities, he is a kind and just ruler. He has a deep love for his wife, Ithaca, and his people. Although he never says he misses his son, probably because he has been gone so long that they barely know eachother.
ReplyDeleteOdysseus is confident, but I would say more on the cocky side. When he dines with the Phaeacian's two men challenge him to take part in their games of sport. He gives this sad claim that his heart is too burdened to take part in their games with them. But when Broadsea says that "Odysseus is no athlete"(p196), Odysseus gets up and launches a discus farther than anyone could. He then goes on to boast about being better at "wrestling, boxing, racing, and spear throwing".(p198) I guess his burdens weren't that bad. If Odysseus would have been the challenger I would have called him a hustler. He could scam anyone.
Oydsseus is a lot like a politician to me. He is a good leader who knows how to keep his people happy and he knows how to get what he wants. For Odysseus being so clever, he makes a very foolish mistake in making the gods angry. He believes he is in control of his own destiny, and his cockiness results in his punishment of being kept away from his home for so long. Telemachus definitely inherits the tact and charm from his father. I see a likeness between the great speeches they give.
I also agree that Odysseus cannot be described in one sentence. I see him more as an oxymoron or a paradox. All his good and bad qualities contradict one another, but I guess the same could be said for all human beings.
If I had one word to describe Odysseus it would be cunning, and I feel the word itself, "cunning", can be taken either negatively or positively.
ReplyDeleteWhen I think of a person who is cunning, I imagine someone who is extremely well liked, but who is often involved in trickery to get their way. Odysseus holds great power and is loved by many, but somehow manages to get into all kinds of difficult situations. However no one seems notices the bad things too much and is somewhat blinded by the prettier, more appealing characteristics of his personality.
I agree with Jenny when she states that Odysseus is inconsistent. In fact, Odysseus' inconsistency is one of the more reliable characteristics of his personality. To put it in more modern terms, he is somewhat of a drama queen if you ask me. The complexities of this character always have us wondering what he will do next. Sometimes his actions are polar opposites of one another.
For example, in book 8, page 208; we have a passage that stats "how Odysseus marched right up to Deiphobus' house like a god of war on attack." However a few lines later, Odysseus "melts into tears" and is compared to a woman weeping. However I feel his passion is what holds true in all of his forms, making him such a memorable and well thought of character.
I think that Odysseus is a somewhat ‘real’ representation of what a man’s personality should consist of, in terms of ideals. He possesses super human strength when fighting. He is always the winner. He is more realistic than even some characters in today’s literature in the fact that Odysseus actually shows emotion. He does not pretend to be macho, or pretend to be strong when he has reached his limits. We get many different views on how we are supposed to read Odysseus. On page 261, he is described as a man who would never cheat or fraud those who help him. In book 11, Odysseus is faced with his mother’s ghost. I found it very touching that he had tried to hug his mother three times and each time she slipped through his fingers. This shows his deep family connection and his vulnerability to those he loves. He is a man that definitely sets out to finish what he starts. Although he learned of his mother’s death by seeing her ghost, he still does not stop to see her until he questions Tiresias. He is depicted as the ‘traditional’ man who must sleep with multiple women to satisfy his male urges. In the Book 10, he sleeps with Circe. The plot plans this as the only way he can save his friends by getting them turned back into men. This is just one more justification on why it is acceptable for Odysseus to be unfaithful to Penelope. Odysseus is depicted as arrogant or haughty. On page 227-8, Odysseus has already managed to escape from the Cyclops by gauging out his eye. Once the men are on the ship Odysseus continues to taunt him. “So headstrong-why? Why rile the beast again?” This is what one of his crew members say to him. This shows the reader that he is the type who may kick his opponent when he is down. This is not a noble characteristic of a hero. Odysseus also challenges authority. He knew that the Cyclops was Poseidon’s some and still hurt him knowing that he may feel the vengeance of Poseidon. In class we discussed that Telemachus is seen crying. In books 7-12 Odysseus cries quite often for his lost companions and his family. I think that this just makes him a more realistic man figure because he shows his emotions. We know that men are not made of stone and I do not know why they think that must portray this image to everyone. His depictions are not normal of what we consider a ‘hero’ to be. Since this text is 2800 years old, I wonder how society pushed the belief that men cannot show emtoions onto males. You would think that texts like these would have set the record for how a 'real' man should behave/act.
ReplyDeleteI think Odysseus is consistently complicated. Sometimes he follows what the gods say, but other times he comes up with his own creative plans to save himself and his crew. Most of the time though, he has little control over anything in his life because of the gods telling him what to do and helping him along the way or prophecies made that he must fulfill.
ReplyDeleteOne example of this would be in book nine when Odysseus and his crew are stuck in the Cyclops cave. He came up with the plan to carve the club into a stake and call himself nobody (p 221, lines 356-373) No gods helped him with this plan. He used his own brain and wit to create it, but the Cyclops later states that a prophecy was spoken that would have Odysseus gouge out his eye (lines 563-575). This was a plan created by the gods. So while Odysseus may have come up with the plan, it was part of his destiny to gouge out the Cyclops eye. And even in that, it makes me wonder if that plan was all his or if somehow, not mentioned, a god gave him the idea to create a stake without Odysseus even realizing. The Cyclops then continues with his speech, urging Poseidon to never let Odysseus reach home (lines 584-595). This again proves, that no matter what Odysseus does or tries to do, the gods are the ones really in control.
Another example of when he follows what the gods tell him to is in book 10. Part of his crew get drugged by Circe so that they no longer remember why they are there and turned into pigs. When Odysseus hears of what happened, he immediately makes his way to Circe's palace but on his way, he is stopped by Hermes who gives him his plan and a drug to stop what Circe will give him. The god tells him everything he must do, step-by-step, and he follows (pg 239, line 310-334). It seems to me that Odysseus is always being helped by the gods to survive, yet he gets all the credit for being to great and witty. At this point, I would have to agree with Jenny and say that Odysseus is somewhat fake at this point. Everyone, especially Odysseus, take credit for what the gods really do and the aid they give.
To sum Odysseus up in one sentence would be very difficult. The characters have to many pieces to them that are opposites, yet unseen, or just far to complicated to capture in one line.
I agree with Courtney with the fact of, Odysseus is difficult to sum up in one sentence. There are just too many facets of Odysseus' life to be summed up entirely in one sentence.
ReplyDeleteUnlike other memebers of the class however, I think my faith in Odysseus's character really developed through Telemachus's view of his father, especially in regards to the praise the strangers give of him. For example, in book 4 line 301, when Menelaus is talking to Helen, he references Odysseus and says, "And I have traveled over a good part of the world but never once have I laid eyes on a man like him- what a heart that fearelss Odysseus had inside him!" Then, Menelaus proceeds to praise Odysseus in more depth. Additionally, as we see throughout Telemachus's travels, all the strangers he encounters only speak of high praise in regards to Odysseus.
With these outside sources continually praising and complimenting Odysseus, it develops a character reference far beyond what a reader can interpret on their own. Therefore, even though Odysseus is inconsistent in majority of his behavior, the consensus of the characters in the story seem to support the hero figure within Odysseus.
Odysseus is hard to explain in one word. I know there is one out there but I can't figure out just the perfect one for him. He is certainly not consistent. But I don't think thats necessarily a bad thing. I know in my mind it makes the story a bit more exciting. You never know what he will choose to do or how he will do it. If he will come up with a plan of his own or with a little help from the gods. It keeps on our toes. And in your paragraph at the top about how you can read it many times and each time come away with fresh insights...I believe that to be so true. It's almost like reading the Bible (expect not). But everytime I read it, I learn something new or I see it in a different way...A fresh way. And same with the Odysseey. I read this book in High school and now I'm reading it in this class and it is truly like a new book to me. Sometimes I feel though, that he is not thinking about others and just thinking about himself. That is hard to decide because when reading this that is your first reaction to him but think about what could be going through his mind, and what he is going through. He is not up to his fathers greatness but he isnt his father so he's learning as he goes. I consider him a hero in his own little confused way.
ReplyDeleteIf you look way back in book 2 around pages 93 and 94 you see how his son is talking about him and its hard to decide whether he is ashamed of his father and that is why he doesn't want to be talking about him with the others because his mother and him are being ridiculed or if he still has respect for him. I've read it over and over and I think he has both feelings about it. He is also confused about what his father has done to his family and people.
Odysseus is consistently complicated in my opinion because although he is consistent with his heroism he is complicated because you never seem to know what he will do next you never know which God he will piss off next. He is a great king who everyone loved but im not sure if his people see him that way anymore because he hasn't been there for a long time. I'm sure the people see him as a great warrior and a great leader from the past but absence makes people forget what their king or their leader have done. As for father i dont think he's that great of a father because he has never been there for Telemachus so he couldn't really be a father to him. I do agree with hcannon when they said that the Gods controlled him because he never really had the chance to be a father because Gods have kept him away especially poseidon.
ReplyDeleteI would have to start off by agreeing with Luke when saying that Odysseus is a very complex, but simple man. He is complex because the number of different traits he shows throughout the story thus far. He is a strong warrior, a great leader that his people would gladly follow; he is even respected and known by leaders in other parts. He also loves his wife and misses his home. Going back to book 5 page 157, “and found him there on the headland, sitting, still, weeping, his eyes never dry, his sweet life flowing away with the tears he wept for his foiled journey home”. This is just one of the many passages where Odysseus shows his emotions, I think part is obviously because he misses his family, home, and all that he rules. The other part I believe is that he is ashamed, here this great warrior, leader, is kept captive. For a character that has so much confidence in oneself to have the rug pulled out from underneath him is hard to take. As a father, I think Odysseus is a good one. Clearly Telemachus is upset about his father’s disappearance, so much that he travels all over in search of news.
ReplyDeleteI definitely think it is too hard to summarize Odysseus in one sentence. There are too many different characteristics and views to analyze, even in the book the reader is constantly learning more about his character.
When I think of the many different male roles throughout the poem of The Odyssey, Odysseus fits in with the mold. From what I have read, Odysseus is charming. All men from that era seem to have that quality. He has a great way with words. It even seems that everyone must have a way with words or speak elegantly in order to get what they want. There are many examples of Odysseus speaking charmingly, such as page 174, when speaking to Alcinous' daughter. With both Odysseus and his son, Telemachus, I feel that if they didn't know how to speak in a charming and brave manner, they would never get what they want. Plus, people would look down on them as fools.
ReplyDeleteAnother trait that both Odysseus and his son share is using sympathy to get what they want. Odysseus keeps repeating himself about all the suffering he has done. They both want people to feel sorry for them. Odysseus is speaking of his suffering on page 186.
Lastly, I think Odysseus is very sensitive for being portrayed as a "Godly" man. I think it is all in his looks and strength. But, on page 197, he felt the need to prove his strength in sports after being ridiculed by the young boy. A real man, would not have needed to prove anything, and dismissed the young boys' taunts. He also cries an aweful lot.
One question I have consistently had throughout this story so far, is why does everyone seem to get what they ask for? The royalty we have come across so far gives so freely what anyone needs. And not just little things like food and water,but whole ships and crew? I guess I just find it hard to believe that they would give all this to complete strangers and not even think twice...
Not just one word comes to mind when I think of Odysseus. I agree with Courtney and Chris that he is complicated. The first word that comes to my mind when I think of Odysseus is Hero. In the story it is clearly put out there that he is a Hero. An example of this is in Book 4 page 127 line 119: "No one, no Achaean labored hard as Odysseus labored or achieved so much". He is presented here as a hardworking man who achieved a lot.
ReplyDeleteTelemachus sees his father as a hero and loves him a lot. In book 4 on page 128 line 126: "Such memories stirred in the young prince a deep desire to grieve for Odysseus. Tears streamed down his cheeks and wet the ground when he heard his father's name, both hands clutching his purple robe before his eyes". Telemachus longs to see his father again, he is proud of who is father is and what he has accomplished.
Odysseus also has a way of leaving you lingering on wondering what is going to happen next. One moment he can be very strong and ready to fight the next moment he can be having a breakdown. You never know what to expect from Odysseus. This also shows that he is not a straightforward man, he is filled with energy and passion.
I have to agree with both Jenny Pelc and Jenny Jacobs. I agree with Pelc in that all the characters seem to be working an angle with every person they meet. They all have their own agenda to attend to while talking to the other characters. For example, when Telemachus meets Menelaus and talks to him, he keeps secret his identity so he could get an answer with out bias. He could have told him who he was and could have been treated even better than he was.
ReplyDeleteI also agree with Jenny Jacobs in that no matter what character we come across they all seem to put Odysseus up on a pedestal with the gods. They all refer to him as he god like hero or man. Nestor and Menelaus all have good words to say about him, which is to be expected since they fought with him at Troy. I think the most interesting praise Odysseus got was from the bard on the island of Phaeacia. This man was blind and never met Odysseus before, yet when he sang his song he praised great brave Odysseus and Achilles (pg194& pg 207). So it seems wherever he goes people have good things to say about him even if he never met them.
So even though Odysseus seems to be working an angle with all the characters he encounters, his general character trait is one of bravery and honor and all that those characteristics entail.
Odysseus is consistently complicated. As we discussed so far, especially with the Iliad, Odysseus is a cunning character and oftentimes with a complex character like that, it is hard to get a perfect read on them because what they do often has an ulterior motive. I do think that we can probably agree that he is a character with strong will, so what he chooses to do is based on what seems most likely get him the closest to his objective. Examples of this occur in book five. In book four, he has been tempted by the goddess Calypso to stay with her and become immortal. Odysseus himself admits that Penelope cannot rival Calypso's beauty, but even so, Odysseus feels he must return to his homeland. The fact that he is able to continue thinking about his homeland after so many years away and in the light of a beautiful goddess trying to seduce him is a testament to his great will. Again in book five, Odysseus builds a raft so that he may leave. After he casts off from Calypso's island to start home, Poseidon happens upon Odysseus. Poseidon, still being angry, sets a storm upon Odysseus. He could have despaired and let himself drown, but instead "...at last he fought his way to the surface spewing bitter brine... " (pg. 162). Again instead of giving up, he continues to fight.
ReplyDeleteAnother strong characteristic I feel Odysseus has is that he knows how to behave when with different groups so that he may get what he needs. In the Iliad, Odysseus agrees to go off to fight for Menelaus and he becomes a great hero. In order for that to happen, he has to prove his worth, if not by fighting then by strategy. However, in book 7 on page 184, Odysseus is described as pleading to Queen Arete because he knows that he needs to make her feel compassion for him so that he may reach his homeland.
These are just a few examples, but I feel that these characteristics make him a consistent character. I feel that typically, he will follow these to a conclusion, it just might not be the conclusion that many readers thought it would be.
I think Odysseus is consistent. I believe that shines through in the way he makes decisions, he almost always does what he feels is right and what needs to be done to get home, even if that means upsetting a God or two. For example in book 9 he ends up blinding the cyclops and making an enemy of Poseidon for the rest of the story.
ReplyDeleteOdysseus does make mistakes though. He is driven by his instincts and every once in awhile those instincts are clouded by his ego and he does make bad decisions. An example of this would also be in book 9 when he taunts Poseidon because he feels cocky and doesn't think of the consequences. Odysseus in my mind represents all of us at one point or another in our lives. We follow our instincts, but we are flawed and at times let our emotions and ego get in the way.
I agree with my classmate Luke in saying that Odyessus is a very complex man. From hearing the descriptions of him in the early parts of the book, the reader begins to get a picture of a strong and couragous man. You can see this impression of Odyessus when King Menelaus speaks of him on page 127, line 120, he describes that " No one, no Achaean, labored as hard as Odyessus labored or achieved so much". From this the reader can see a picture of a man who fought and struggled but managed to come out on top.
ReplyDeleteBut even with this knowledge I find it hard to sum Odyessus up in just one simple sentence as I agree with Jenny Pelc in saying that his character is somewhat of a contradiction. The reader sees this noble man who has suffered a great deal and wishes to return to glory and his home, and from that description one could say he is loyal. But on page 159, passage 250, the narrator reveals that " And now, withdrawing into the cavern's deep recesses, long in each other's arms they lost themselves in love." Here we see that Odyessus is not as loyal as we believe him to be.
If I had to sum Odysseus up in one sentence, that sentence would be: “It’s complicated”.
ReplyDeleteOn page 94 Telemachus reminds the men in Ithaca of what kind of king his father was, saying “my noble father who ruled among you years ago, each of you here, and kindly as a father to his children.” King Odysseus was a good and kind king whom his people looked up to and respected. He is portrayed as a wise king who is just and fair and ruled over a time of peace. King Nestor and Menelaus remember Odysseus fondly as wise and heroic man. Penelope seems to be the picture of a grieving wife when she interrupts a singer who was telling the story of the Achaeans’ Journey Home from Troy (p.88-89). She says she longs for her husband who is alive in her memory and latter she weeps for her beloved husband until Athena takes pity on her and “sealed her eyes with sleep”. To elicit such a reaction from Penelope even after nearly 20 years of being gone Odysseus must have been a stunning husband. No woman would hold out for 20 years for a man who treated her badly or a man she didn’t really love. Husband Odysseus must have been as great and kind as King Odysseus.
So Odysseus is kind and smart and a good guy, but that does not mean that he doesn’t have a down side. His pride gets him into serious trouble when he blinds the Cyclopes and tells him his name. It brings down the sea gods wrath and is the reason for most of his problems now. His pride is his biggest downfall despite some redeeming qualities. He also shows some poor judgment when deciding to stay with the Queen of Aeaea for so long and killing the sun gods sheep (he was warned not to). So while I think Odysseus is in all a good character with some great qualities, he does show some very human flaws. This makes him a very complicated character and makes the story more relatable.
I also agree that Odysseus is a very complex character who is difficult to sum up in one sentence. He is perceived as a strong, god-like man, but he also has a very emotional side to him. Several characters view him as a strong and powerful leader; however, he is also said to have a kind heart. Odysseus is physically strong, but on the other hand, his cunning mind is his greatest strength.
ReplyDeleteThe adjectives that the characters use to talk about Odysseus makes it very apparent that they think highly of him. Even though Odysseus has been absent for the majority of Telemachus’s life, Telemachus still has great respect for his father and believes that he was a great and kind-hearted ruler. “First, I have lost my noble father who ruled among you years ago, each of you here, and kindly as a father to his children.” (94, line 50). Another example is on page 110, line 91. “I am on the trail of my father’s widespread fame, you see, searching the earth to catch some news of great-hearted King Odysseus who, they say fought with you to demolish Troy some years ago.” Even the gods, such as Athena, speak highly of Odysseus and describe him of being great, yet kind “Think: not one of the people whom he ruled remembers Odysseus now, that godlike man, and kindly as a father to his children.” (152, 12). Not only does Athena describe him as kind, but also godlike. Odysseus even has to explain to the Phaeacians that he is man and not a god. “Cross that thought from your mind. I’m nothing like the immortal gods who rule the skies, either in build or breeding. I’m just a mortal man.” (186, 244).
Odysseus is also described as being a great warrior with a strong mind. This is apparent when people retell the stories of him at Troy. Menelaus tells Telemachus that, "no one, no Achaean labored hard as Odysseus labored or achieved so much" (127, line 119). Another example is when the story of the wooden horse at Troy is retold. Menelaus again speaks of Odysseus's bravery and cunning mind. "Now then, I have studied, in my time, the plans and minds of greats ones by the score. And I have traveled over a good part of the world but never once have I laid eyes on a man like him--what a heart that fearless Odysseus had inside him!" (132-133 line 299). Another example of Odysseus's strategic mind is in book 9. The cunning plan he devises is what saves him from the Cyclopes. He tells the Cyclopes that his name is "nobody", and he gives him wine to make him intoxicated. Odysseus is then given the opportunity to stab the Cyclopes in the eye. None of the Cyclopes's friends come to his aid when he screams out in pain, however, because he shouts out that, "Nobody's killing me now by fraud and not by force!" (224 line 455).
Finally, although Odysseus is seen as cunning, fearless, and a great leader, he is also emotional. One example where he shows his emotions is on page 194 when the harper sings, "but Odysseus, clutching his flaring sea-blue cape in both powerful hands, drew it over his head and buried his handsome face, ashamed his hosts might see him shedding tears" (194, line 99).
I agree with Dustin in that Odysseus is consistantly complex. Odysseus cares what people think about him, yet he is not afraid to show his feelings. When he ability to compete in sportd was challenged in book eight, line 200, Odysseus replied in line 260, "As for spears, I can fling a spear as far as the next man wings an arrow!" He rises to the challenge and easily beats the other men. He wants it to be known that he is a champion. However, it is also mentioned several times that "great Odysseus melted into tears (line 585)." He is not afraid to be emotional in front of a large group of people.
ReplyDeleteOdysseus is also extremely loyal. His is tempted severaltimes to stay in foreign lands and offered gifts and hands in marriage, but he stays faithful to his voyage to return home to Ithaca. HE graciously accepts the kindness and gifts of his hosts, but then begs them to let him continue on his journey. I believe he has too many facets to be summed up in just one sentence. The further into the story, the more complex he becomes.
I think we have all come to notice that Odysseus, is an man of many traits and has many strong characteristics. That make him a great leader.
ReplyDeleteHowever, I really liked reading Book 8: when it expressed Odysseus in a athletic way. On pg 196, I like the quote," why do you taunt me so with such a challenge?" I think the quote expresses how cocky and confident Odysseus really is, and that confidence is what help him be a leader. Then a few lines later he expresses his quick tongue, with "Indecent talk, my friend. You, you're a reckless fool.
In the same book he shows his charming side, on page 204 as he is saying farewell he says, "A warm farewell to you,too, my friend. May the gods grant you good fortune." All in all I think he has a dynamic personality.
I agreed with the many people who have thus far said that Odysseus is a complex character. I do not think that I could sum him up in one word because Odysseus exhibits different characteristics based on the situations he faces. When faced with situations that require him to be brave, cunning, witty, and powerful Odysseus is, however when he faces emotionally troubling times, Odysseus is not afraid to show his true feelings.
ReplyDeleteIn book 9, Odysseus shows his wittiness and bravery when faced with the Cyclops. He came up with his clever plan to blind the Cyclops, then “ordered his shipmates to all cast lots- who’d brave it out with me to hoist our stake and grind it into his eye” (221, line 370). Odysseus is brave because he asks who will help him. He does not order his men to risk their lives and complete the task but rather risks his life too. I believe it is instances like this one that allow his shipmates to trust him.
In book 8, Odysseus hears Demodocus sing of his long journey. When hearing the song, so many memories are brought back that Odysseus becomes terribly sad. “But great Odysseus melted into tears, running down from his eyes to wet his cheeks… as a woman weeps” (208, line 586). In this instance Odysseus is not afraid to show his sorrow. This part in the book can reveal to us a little bit about the hospitality of others during this time. Alcinous does not even know who Odysseus is when he sees him crying yet shows sympathy by asking Demodocus to stop singing. He sees that the song is troubling and Odysseus and cares enough to ask for the song to be stopped. This is very different compared to how someone might respond today if they were to see a man crying when hearing a song.
As we discussed in class about Telemachus and Penelope, we can find a character’s complexity from different perspectives (Telemachus is modest from one side but too emotional from the other side). Therefore I think any character cannot be described or summarized in one sentence.
ReplyDeleteJust as our personality, there is no way to just understand us in one-way or one perspective; we have to incorporate an objective point of view to have a better understanding. For Odysseus, we encountered him as a fearless warrior he was aggressive in the war, as a leader, a good companion (“my dearest friend” Book 4, p129, line 186) and a hero, and we can take it as a positive feature. He was also described as “looks like a deathless god” (Book 8 line 14, p192). His self-confidence drove him to compete in sport (Book 8). But later he could not control himself from the affection to beautiful Nausicaa, and be unfaithful to his wife (Book 6). He was also very emotional when he couldn’t help crying to Demodocus’s songs, and caused the King’s attention. We can still see that the hero-like almost perfect Odyssey still has weaknesses. As the story goes, Homer gradually showed the complexity of Odysseus.
He also possessed the quality of poise as a guest to Alcinious, because of his determination to go home after what he had experienced (Book8, from p195). Not like those youths who attempted to demonstrate their manhood, Odysseus competed with Broadreas only to defend his glory and honor as a hero after the insult. The story demonstrated consistency that Odysseus remained his most obvious trait of hero but altered to adjust other plots. By enriching his personality, we can picture a complete person in front of us with flesh and blood, not only a vague impression of a hero in some legend.
As for the author, multiple features of a character will be better for developing plots and engaging in conflicts. When it comes to making decisions, it is consisted such as Odysseus and Telemachus determination, but the other sides of his personality came in and make it harder to make the right decision. It makes the story and the character more realistic to understand and predict their feelings if the character's depiction is varying from different perceptions. Thus, I think it's consistently complicated.
Odysseus's character is way too complicated and it's quite difficult to sum him up in one sentence.
ReplyDeleteOdysseus is a courageous warrior and a great king who fought so many battles all for his people, for glory and fame. He is well known among the other kings like Menelaus and Nestor who remember him as a hero and have all praises about him to tell his son Telemachus.
From book 4: Lines 275-279 tell us that Odysseus was very cunning as he infiltrated Troy by slipping into the enemy's city disguised as a beggar.
From book 5: Lines 392-396 we see that Odysseus is a fighter. After his ship was wrecked in the storm due to Poseidon's rage, Odysseus decides to stay put in his efforts to brave the storm and refuses to abandon his ship.
In book 8 when the bard sings about the battle of Troy, Odysseus is filled with emotions due to the painful memories of the past. He weeps like a common man would do when faced with such terrifying memories.
Thus, Odysseus character is complex and it is not possible to talk of all his character traits.
I think Odysseus is a very courageous character. Although it's hard to choose just one word to sum up his complex characteristics. Like Erica said, his actions depend on the situation he is in. Odysseus is well honored no matter who he faces. In addition, he has won some extraordinary battles when he was the under dog. On page 114 in Book 3 Telemachus was talking to Nestor, and Odysseus' name was mentioned. Nestor recalls a story where the brave Odysseus shows the "most affection a mortal has ever showed". At times, he relies on the help of others but during a journey like his it's important to use any help you can get.
ReplyDeleteOverall, I think that is how Telemachus views his father. Everywhere he went on his journey to find Odysseus he came across people who raved about his father. All the stories he heard about his father's bravery began to help him get a sense of what kind of man he was. I think that Telemachus is his biggest supporter altough Odysseus has never really been there for him. That shows how powerfully Telemachus' views on his father become once he hears all of the heroic things he did from people who have experienced his greatness.
Odysseus is a strong-willed man who uses his strength, determination and intelligence to escape certain situations. He is considered god-like and has the respect of some of the gods and his son, Telemachus. I feel that Telemachus sees his father in the same way, and that is why he himself is deteremined to not give up hope on his father's survival.
ReplyDeleteI don't think you can sum up Odysseus in just one sentence. He is a complex character and has many characteristics that would need to be explained. Throughout the book he becomes more and more intense, and we learn something new about his character.
Odysseus thinks he is a victim and that the gods can torture him as they wish. He is greatly troubled at how he is treated by the Poseidon and thinks he doesn't deserve this ill treatment. However for all his grief he still manages to show off his abilities (pg.198)and he is wily when it comes to tricking others, such as the cyclops (pg. 224). He knows when to be proud and when to be humble in order to get what he wants (pg.184) when he pleads for mercy and kindness by the Queen Arete. Odysseus contradicts himself as a character because of his actions. He will perform bravely and perform humble, or be a real hero or become cunning. It is difficult to exactly describe who Odysseus truly is as a character.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Kala Villinski's post that Odysseus is depicted as a real man is. He is seen in both lights as a humble, honest, and couragous man. He is humble, particularly in Book 7 when he is alone with the King and Queen of Phaeacian. He also defends the phaeacian princess on pg. 189 and kind of makes himself look like a gentleman by
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"She urged me herself to follow with her maids. I chose not to, fearing embarrassment in fact- what if you took offencse, seeing us boh together? Suspicious we are, we men who walk the earth?"
This passage shows how Odysseus' personality is of a man who is doing whatever it takes to get home. He withhold his name to seem humble, defends the young princess who wanted to assit him, and he admits that he is if the possitions were switched he understands the king and queens views. All people are complex the good and bad in all people is what makes them human, that is why Odysseus is so real of a man that it is as if he jumps off the page.
I think we have all come to notice that Odysseus, is an man of many traits and has many strong characteristics. That make him a great leader.
ReplyDeleteHowever, I really liked reading Book 8: when it expressed Odysseus in a athletic way. On pg 196, I like the quote," why do you taunt me so with such a challenge?" I think the quote expresses how cocky and confident Odysseus really is, and that confidence is what help him be a leader. Then a few lines later he expresses his quick tongue, with "Indecent talk, my friend. You, you're a reckless fool.
In the same book he shows his charming side, on page 204 as he is saying farewell he says, "A warm farewell to you,too, my friend. May the gods grant you good fortune." All in all I think he has a dynamic personality.
To sum up Odysseus in one sentence is impossible without leaving so much out. He is a very simple man that very complicated things have happened to. All he truly wants is to go home. Yet he can't get there easily. He is a fantastic leader, good husband, and he wants the chance to be a good father. His son and his wife and very few others are capable of seeing him this way. He does get lazy at some points, yet he is only a man, and he has been traveling for twenty years. He knows when to be sensitive and when to be tough for his crew. He is compassionate for many at the same time.
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